Lynne, yes - you are absolutely right! What you say is correct and I in no way disagree with the factuals of it.

My point was that there *is* indeed this difference and *few* are aware of it. I let my less articulate side state it, and that was a mistake on my part.

The History that Sage posted is the "real" I was reffering to, that's how it all began. Sadly it's little known and the more common music/poetry-version is what's usually found these days.
And among these are, *of course*, "real ones"! It's just this "death=cool"-thing that pisses me off! Both the people who think it and the ones that think all those who think it are goths. The wannabes brings down the whole reputation of the original idea and a whole sub-culture gets the final branding.

And I just want to add that I myself am not a goth, nor do I try to be. Other than the fact that I do share my stompingground with them (historically) I don't have much of a connection at all.

I just don't take misguided hostility very well, which is a side I believe I have to work on as it does get the better of me from time to time.

This is beautiful! Somehow peaceful.

I'm more concerned with what the bleepin' that couch is doing there!!

The mask was just so obviously out of place (and time) that it had to have been planted. Drew's statement weren't a big surpice.

I just *have* to comment on this.....

Goth is a sub-culture that very few actually understand. In reality it has very little (if even anything) to do with death and blood and all that mumbo but that's what all the wannabes think and the wannabes are those who let themselves get known by the world, so to speak. Therefor - the world in general has the wrong idea of what a goth really is, because frankly - 90% of "goths" aren't really goths at all.

Being a "real" goth has to do with how you look at life and death (which is far from the *popular* themes) and how your mind works.
I say "Goth" and you (not pointed to anyone in particular, just as in general) think black clothes, dyed hair death-metal music blasting...
Sure, many goths do choose to present themselves this way, but as the *real* culture states - you are free to do whatever you wish, no bars held.
Ok, so maybe wearing pink and yellow pigtails, listening to Britney Spears classifies you as un-goth as you can possibly be - heh, think again - if the overall mentality is there (accepting, respecting and daring to live) this individual can fall within the lines of being a goth.

Goth is, as just said - a state of mind! All the people running around talking about death with their *How sweet the pain is killing my tortured spirit*-rant don't even know what it's about, let alone are they *real* goths.

And this I DO direct to those who have spoken on the subject here - Lashing out at this individual to begin with and then continuing to state how naïve and "stupid" ALL goths are is just as uninformed as the original poster's perspective.

You may look at me any way you wish and think what you like, but this needed to be stated. I've read the comments on how tired you in the business of caring for others are of being misjudged and "assumed" to be tyrants just havin' a laugh with the poor people that need help. Believe you me - goths are just as tired of being thought to be nothing but lazy, death-obsessed vampire-wannabes!

We have some more modern versions of a mangler in our basement ( I live in a thirteen-storied high building with 8 flats on each level) and I have actually never seen anyone use them.... And I've lived here for 24 years now...

My mum taught me how to use them when I was very young so to keep my fingers still attached and all, but still to this day I get an eerie feeling from just walking past the rooms containing the machines.

=) Often feel quite silly for it. After all - they're used for laundry....... hehe

That thing looks *evil*, haha.

I think the ickiest thing is that there's still goo on the instruments........ O.o

Autoclaves are also used (and in most countries required by law) by proffesional piercers. Both the instruments and "jewlery" have to go through their treatment before being used on a person and the machine itself has to be checked monthly at a hospital to ensure it's function and lack of bacteria.

(Amazing photos, btw!)